Strange Cargo.

[Dr Bunsen Honeydew]

When I went to Tottenham Tech in the mid 60's I was one of only few Brits there, students were from everywhere, and it was an eye opener for a well brought up white middle class boy. I have never been colour prejudiced, I am idiot or uneducated brainwashed dick prejudiced and they can come in all colours and shapes. My prejudice comes in when I am faced with blocked minds and severely distorted realities as I am faced with when discussing anything of any consequence with a practising Muslim or born again Christian or fanatical Jew - they severely piss me off to the point I want to put them in that container and drop them in the middle of the North Sea

[kimangelis]

Agreed and more so. I seem to have opened a can of worms here and if I am boring or annoying anyone, then I apologise for that.... only.

My childhood and much of my early teenage were filled with the mix of race, culture and creed only found in the industrialised regions of the north and midlands (of England) and London, and I am richer for that. Having said that I railed quite strongly about the 'Muslim Warriors' of Burnley and Nelson as much as I had fought the NF and BNP in earlier years.

This is not about one creed, religion or view being better than someone else's. It's about standing your ground about what is (to me) an outrageous statement of wanting to return a bunch of 'illegal immigrants' from where they came. Sorry, but I've heard it all before. I cannot tolerate Muslim extremism any more than I can Presbyterian or Catholic (and I am Catholic) ideology or the view that, in a particular country, one must adhere to the 'official' religion or face persecution.

What I would like is for a little more understanding of the plight of people who are really at the end of what they consider their life as they know it. Yes there are clowns who regularly risk life and limb to enter the UK to make a better life. And yes I understand the flooding of UK shores by Eastern European nationals and the effect that flood has had on hard-pressed south coast councils. Afghanistan, like Syria, Libya, Iraq, is a war-torn disaster and the Sikhs needed somewhere to go away from the persecution and the killing. All I am asking is that be recognised for what it is. Sending them back to where they came is not an option. We're better than that aren't we?

Over and out.

[ArseHats]

Agreed and more so. I seem to have opened a can of worms here and if I am boring or annoying anyone, then I apologise for that.... only.

My childhood and much of my early teenage were filled with the mix of race, culture and creed only found in the industrialised regions of the north and midlands (of England) and London, and I am richer for that. Having said that I railed quite strongly about the 'Muslim Warriors' of Burnley and Nelson as much as I had fought the NF and BNP in earlier years.

This is not about one creed, religion or view being better than someone else's. It's about standing your ground about what is (to me) an outrageous statement of wanting to return a bunch of 'illegal immigrants' from where they came. Sorry, but I've heard it all before. I cannot tolerate Muslim extremism any more than I can Presbyterian or Catholic (and I am Catholic) ideology or the view that, in a particular country, one must adhere to the 'official' religion or face persecution.

What I would like is for a little more understanding of the plight of people who are really at the end of what they consider their life as they know it. Yes there are clowns who regularly risk life and limb to enter the UK to make a better life. And yes I understand the flooding of UK shores by Eastern European nationals and the effect that flood has had on hard-pressed south coast councils. Afghanistan, like Syria, Libya, Iraq, is a war-torn disaster and the Sikhs needed somewhere to go away from the persecution and the killing. All I am asking is that be recognised for what it is. Sending them back to where they came is not an option. We're better than that aren't we?

Over and out.

Kim, I feel it's more than that. My sense is that it's something about the extents to which it is possible and desireable to see the humanity behind the difference(s) (in a human's race, gender, sexuality, where their ancestors lived, where they happened to be born, what culture(s) they have absorbed, how strongly they hold their views, how well educated they are, how much they had to pay for their education, whether they even had the opportunity to pay for an education, etc.,...).

[Dr Bunsen Honeydew]

I have to also stand up for the so called bigots here. These people knew what they were doing when they got into that container, it was a decision they have to take the consequences for. There would be no people smugglers if there weren't people willing to take the chances of being smuggled and pay for it. So you take a chance and sometimes you lose. Being caught as an illegal immigrant in their terms is losing, catching them for *us* is winning, and yes of course they should be sent home, and yes of course the people smugglers should be put in jail.

[Dr Bunsen Honeydew]

What I don't understand is why do they fight so hard to come here, often passing through Italy or Fance or Spain on the way. Personally i would prefer to be there.

[slinger]

I think too many people are looking at these poor sods as if they are rational people making rational decisions. They didn't decide that they needed a bit of a holiday and thought hopping in a container would be just the ticket.

As recently as 1992 Afghanistan had a vibrant and strong Sikh community with numbers estimated at 75,000. Now this is down to just 4,000. The declining numbers have been the result of systematic persecution by the Mujahideen and Taleban which, if anything, has increased in recent years. According to the Sikh Council UK, the Afghan Sikh community has had property and businesses forcibly taken over, been prey to kidnappings and ransoms, had a special tax imposed on them and other non-Muslims and several have been killed, including some by beheading.

Source- http://bit.ly/1qHKxPm

Regarding the man that died, according to his Uncle...

...the family travelled on the shipping container in the hope of a better life for the children, who instead had to watch their father die.

Source - http://bit.ly/1qHLsze

I wonder if instead of Sikhs these were Christians escaping persecution and state sanctioned murder at the hands of A. N. Other religion whether the "send 'em back home" brigade would be so vocal. They might even be hailed as heroes.

[zebbo]

I honestly don't think the problem people have is anything to do with race or religion. It's more to do with being taken advantage of. These poor buggers were persecuted back home so would naturally be desperate to leave for somewhere better, quite understandable. However, if they had chosen to stop in any one of the safe countries they crossed to get HERE then maybe those kids wouldn't have had to watch their father die.

[Daniel Quinn]

This assumes they had a choice as to thier destination. Any evidence of this?

[Dr Bunsen Honeydew]

Yes the guys that organised it were based in N Ireland, and the destination for the container was the UK.

It is quite illogical to say that anyone who is persecuted in this mad world should be given fee access to the UK. We are not big enough. Throughout history most people have had challenging lives, it is not going to stop now, it is still the luck of the draw. The solution is not here, the solution is where they are born.

[Daniel Quinn]

I havent read anything which clarifies the status of these refugees . did they pay , were they forced , were they given a brochure of European destinations to choose from ? Of course it is silly to suggest we can harbinger the worlds oppressed , I think kims point was a little more subtle , in that these 12 people should be treated with a little more compassion as opposed to calls of sending them back from whence they came .