Naim price increases

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karatestu
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Naim price increases

Unread post by karatestu »

Have a look at the current Naim price list. Prices have just gone up. :roll:

https://signals.us17.list-manage.com/tr ... e3c7

Copied from elsewhere. These prices are pure greed and not at all related to the performance. They must have looked af the current Linn price list and thought we want some of that.

I wonder what the reaction is from the sheep in the green echo chamber ?
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Re: Naim price increases

Unread post by Nigel »

Years ago, there was a flat earth Hi-fi shop in my home town. As a young man I used to gaze longingly through the window at the Linn, Naim, Rega, Royd equipment. The top of the range gear was expensive but with sacrifice, it was still in the realms of possibility. It no longer is anymore.
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Re: Naim price increases

Unread post by Lindsayt »

Good news for other amplifier manufacturers.

The ones that aren't bothered about capturing the Veblen market.
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karatestu (Sun Nov 07, 2021 10:47 am)

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Re: Naim price increases

Unread post by Wonfor14 »

Also on PF forum:-

Having worked with Naim a few year ago as a consultant, there prices may be justified.
All parts coming into Naim are not nasty cheap rip off parts, and all are very well put through inspection.
The Naim R&D team is huge there is lots of skills there and there processes to make a good product is second to none. This work can cost a small fortune and lots and lots of tooling costs.
Then we start production after extreme testing and brutally done at times (poor things) not just function but heavy on producing a safe product.
Then we move on to listening test of to a group of audio buffs that you will never hear off doing testing blind and knob bashing stuff.
Then to marketing adverts etc, reviews this is bloody expensive.
Now to calculate possible profit margin and costs, the export price as the UK can not support a company as large as Naim so exports are the key. Now retailer and export need to see the same prices all over the planet regarding RRP , or the customer will buy from Joe Blogs.
Exporter want there pound of flesh and there sweeteners this costs money also.
So lets say for example (these are not correct just examples) cost of parts £100, cost of inspection and testing £100, profit needed £200, then marketing oh boy is the expensive £400, export mark up £800 the dealers mark up £1600 now you can see why big companies making good sound solid products will sell a lot more than you think is a fair price. So £3500 + tax is very easy to get too.

I am not saying this fair it is not but wages here are silly compared to poorer countries and we all want well made safe kit. So you have to pay for it some how.
Small companies can't afford the marketing and the export mark up so we sell manly in the UK or on line only, this keeps the price lower and allows us to use better than normal components at a high price. But it also limits our profits so we grow very slowly.

The R&D lads at Naim are very good but they have to produce the Naim sound this is not to my taste but it a lot better than junk from China, a lot better and much better than some of the junk over priced from the USA.
So if you want value for money buy from a UK company that does not have a massive marketing and export side to it.
Other companies that appear to be British are in fact made and assembled in far away countries, like Cambridge Audio, some buy pre assembled PCB to fit into chassis so beware. I like the stuff I make to last longer than a few short years.
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Re: Naim price increases

Unread post by Lindsayt »

The thing with Naim is that they sit in a middle ground between the large Japanese corporates of the 1970's to 1980's, with large global sales to get good economies of scale.
And the sub 5 employee companies that don't have the overheads.

On top of that, Focal will be looking to recoup the costs they incurred in buying Naim.
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Wonfor14 (Sun Nov 07, 2021 3:29 pm)

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Re: Naim price increases

Unread post by Wonfor14 »

Lindsayt wrote: Sun Nov 07, 2021 2:27 pm The thing with Naim is that they sit in a middle ground between the large Japanese corporates of the 1970's to 1980's, with large global sales to get good economies of scale.
And the sub 5 employee companies that don't have the overheads.

On top of that, Focal will be looking to recoup the costs they incurred in buying Naim.
Due to Focal, I lost my contract work with Naim, just as I started to design a cable for them, but this then became TQ cables ,and the British sales guys for Focal started KOG which became the distributors of TQ. They were a pair of trouble makers to put it bluntly, so Focal was glad to get rid of them for sure.
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Lindsayt (Sun Nov 07, 2021 3:59 pm)

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Re: Naim price increases

Unread post by Wonfor14 »


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Re: Naim price increases

Unread post by Lindsayt »

Interesting.

R&D of £1.45 million on a turnover of £33 million.

The highest paid Director received £196,550.
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Wonfor14 (Mon Nov 08, 2021 10:02 pm)

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Re: Naim price increases

Unread post by antonio66 »

Wonfor14 wrote: Sun Nov 07, 2021 11:06 am Also on PF forum:-

Having worked with Naim a few year ago as a consultant, there prices may be justified.
All parts coming into Naim are not nasty cheap rip off parts, and all are very well put through inspection.
The Naim R&D team is huge there is lots of skills there and there processes to make a good product is second to none. This work can cost a small fortune and lots and lots of tooling costs.
Then we start production after extreme testing and brutally done at times (poor things) not just function but heavy on producing a safe product.
Then we move on to listening test of to a group of audio buffs that you will never hear off doing testing blind and knob bashing stuff.
Then to marketing adverts etc, reviews this is bloody expensive.
Now to calculate possible profit margin and costs, the export price as the UK can not support a company as large as Naim so exports are the key. Now retailer and export need to see the same prices all over the planet regarding RRP , or the customer will buy from Joe Blogs.
Exporter want there pound of flesh and there sweeteners this costs money also.
So lets say for example (these are not correct just examples) cost of parts £100, cost of inspection and testing £100, profit needed £200, then marketing oh boy is the expensive £400, export mark up £800 the dealers mark up £1600 now you can see why big companies making good sound solid products will sell a lot more than you think is a fair price. So £3500 + tax is very easy to get too.

I am not saying this fair it is not but wages here are silly compared to poorer countries and we all want well made safe kit. So you have to pay for it some how.
Small companies can't afford the marketing and the export mark up so we sell manly in the UK or on line only, this keeps the price lower and allows us to use better than normal components at a high price. But it also limits our profits so we grow very slowly.

The R&D lads at Naim are very good but they have to produce the Naim sound this is not to my taste but it a lot better than junk from China, a lot better and much better than some of the junk over priced from the USA.
So if you want value for money buy from a UK company that does not have a massive marketing and export side to it.
Other companies that appear to be British are in fact made and assembled in far away countries, like Cambridge Audio, some buy pre assembled PCB to fit into chassis so beware. I like the stuff I make to last longer than a few short years.
I can agree with many of your points Colin, but not the one regarding junk from China. I use a cheap valve amp from China in a second system, it's certainly not the best amp I've owned (previously a Claymore :dance: and Naim) but I certainly could not buy new anything of this calibre made in the uk for a similar price. Many Chinese amps are getting great reviews now, Cayin, Line Magnetic, Reisong/Boyuu, Kinki all spring to mind, not only that many western companies manufacture there as you know (all's fair in Love and Manufacturing :lol: ) I watched a YT video, the demonstrator had a Kinki, 200w per channel amp, he turned the volume up to full, there was no distortion, could you do that with a Naim amp?
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Wonfor14 (Mon Nov 08, 2021 10:03 pm)

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Re: Naim price increases

Unread post by Lindsayt »

antonio66, how much did you pay for your Chinese valve amp?

It's difficult to know what else could be had for the money if we don't know the price.

I think I could gues as to roughly how much you paid. But I could be way out, as it's a decade since I last looked into the price of Chinese valve amps.

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