Power cables and fuses

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George Hincapie
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Power cables and fuses

Unread post by George Hincapie »

I've been reading much on another forum about the positive impact of audiophile power cables and fuses. I'm well aware of the ability of devices like the NVA BMU to clean mains power, but power cables and fuses have always been in my mental 'snake oil' box.

Have any of you experimented with either? I'm keen to read your experiences.
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Re: Power cables and fuses

Unread post by antonio66 »

Never used any of these exotic fuses, the only power cable to really make a difference, and it was clearly audible was a Crystal Cables one, cost £2k, purchased 2nd hand for half price. This was on my brother's system, not mine.
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George Hincapie (Sat Apr 15, 2023 7:13 pm)

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Re: Power cables and fuses

Unread post by Lindsayt »

The Richard Dunn stance of having captive power leads makes a lot of sense. What's the point of having the World's best power lead only for it to go through an IEC plug and socket at the back of your amp / source?

And then there's the UK ring type mains layout...
And UK type wall sockets and plugs.
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Geoff.R.G (Sat Apr 15, 2023 9:52 am)

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Re: Power cables and fuses

Unread post by TheMadMick »

Lindsayt wrote: Sat Apr 15, 2023 8:08 am The Richard Dunn stance of having captive power leads makes a lot of sense. What's the point of having the World's best power lead only for it to go through an IEC plug and socket at the back of your amp / source?

And then there's the UK ring type mains layout...
And UK type wall sockets and plugs.
You mistake the purpose of many specialist power cables. The aim is to remove noise - hence they are high capcitance by wrapping the cores around each other. How much good it does depends on your system and how much noise you have on your mains. I'm sure there's someone out there who can do the sums but I suspect the effect is small at audible frequencies but they do work.

Fuses do make a small difference as well but how cost effective they are is another question.
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Re: Power cables and fuses

Unread post by Geoff.R.G »

Lindsayt wrote: Sat Apr 15, 2023 8:08 am The Richard Dunn stance of having captive power leads makes a lot of sense. What's the point of having the World's best power lead only for it to go through an IEC plug and socket at the back of your amp / source?

And then there's the UK ring type mains layout...
And UK type wall sockets and plugs.
The problem with the IEC connector and the UK mains plug is that the pins are square (rectangular) which makes for cheap manufacture but isn't ideal for getting a good contact, it also uses, in the case of the UK plug, more metal than does a suitable sized round pin.

Ring mains were originally intended to reduce the amount of copper required but there is a significant risk if someone messes about and breaks the ring.

Given that most digital mixers and Dsnakes/Dante boxes use IEC connectors removing the one on your amplifier is to some extent a futile gesture. I very much doubt the studio worried about expensive mains leads either but some might. My view is that if you are that bothered that you are prepared to spend £1,000 on a kettle lead you should cut out the middle man and go to more concerts and live music.
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Lindsayt (Sat Apr 15, 2023 10:36 am)

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Re: Power cables and fuses

Unread post by Lindsayt »

TheMadMick wrote: Sat Apr 15, 2023 8:42 am
Lindsayt wrote: Sat Apr 15, 2023 8:08 am The Richard Dunn stance of having captive power leads makes a lot of sense. What's the point of having the World's best power lead only for it to go through an IEC plug and socket at the back of your amp / source?

And then there's the UK ring type mains layout...
And UK type wall sockets and plugs.
You mistake the purpose of many specialist power cables. The aim is to remove noise - hence they are high capcitance by wrapping the cores around each other. How much good it does depends on your system and how much noise you have on your mains. I'm sure there's someone out there who can do the sums but I suspect the effect is small at audible frequencies but they do work.

Fuses do make a small difference as well but how cost effective they are is another question.
And there was me thinking that the purpose of specialist power cables was to make money for the manufacturer and dealer.

Ferrite rings?
https://uk.rs-online.com/web/c/passive- ... ite-rings/
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Geoff.R.G (Sat Apr 15, 2023 11:35 am) • NSNO2021 (Sat Apr 15, 2023 3:59 pm)

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Re: Power cables and fuses

Unread post by NSNO2021 »

A certain guy in good old Yorkshire is doing very well out of fancy mains cables and other bits and pieces
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George Hincapie (Sat Apr 15, 2023 4:05 pm) • Lindsayt (Sat Apr 15, 2023 4:27 pm)
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Re: Power cables and fuses

Unread post by slinger »

My own opinion is yes, mains leads can make some sort of positive difference, but only up to a certain point. After that, you're just paying to put lipstick on a pig. No matter how pretty it looks, you ain't going to kiss it. Decent insulation, shielding, termination etc. are probably superior to the thing you got free with your ...well ...kettle?

Fuses, on the other hand, I cannot bring myself to believe make the huge differences as are claimed for them. However, people that have actually used them claim they make a difference, and I can't say, flat out, "you're lying" to them or blame the fact that they spent loads of money so they better bloody-well work, and that's what they're hearing observer-expectancy effect a.k.a. expectancy bias. I haven't tried them, never will, can't afford them anyway, and my system is probably not "good" (expensive) enough to register slight differences as seismic events.

That's it though, it's my opinion and isn't even based on facts, because, as I said, I haven't tried them for myself, and never will. My being convinced that fuses are snake oil is based purely on the "You're shitting me, right?" hypothesis. and nothing else.

I've never seen anyone prove, scientifically and incontrovertibly that they do, or don't work. But as we all know, there are things science can't explain anyway, so that will always be a handy claim for either side, even if shown credible evidence that they're wrong.

Personally, I'm just happy that (BOOOOOOOOOOOOORING YOU ALWAYS SAY THIS! :lol: ) I'm, all about the music first, and how it gets into my lugholes second.

Let those who want to buy into hyper-expensive upgrades get on with it, they're not harming me, or ruining my enjoyment of whatever I'm listening to. Their money, their time, their system. Just don't bore my arse off about it, and that goes for the pro and the con groups.

We now return you to your normal musical programming... ;)
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Re: Power cables and fuses

Unread post by George Hincapie »

slinger wrote: Sat Apr 15, 2023 4:31 pmFuses, on the other hand, I cannot bring myself to believe make the huge differences as are claimed for them. However, people that have actually used them claim they make a difference, and I can't say, flat out, "you're lying" to them or blame the fact that they spent loads of money so they better bloody-well work, and that's what they're hearing observer-expectancy effect a.k.a. expectancy bias. I haven't tried them, never will, can't afford them anyway, and my system is probably not "good" (expensive) enough to register slight differences as seismic events.
Interesting, thank you. I have wondered whether it's possible to objectively measure the output of a system in some way, and then repeat that with 'audiophile' fuses fitted to see whether there is any difference. Of course, subjectivists will claim that the measurements are flawed, or the equipment can't measure whatever element it is that's changing. So even if such measurements could be made, it is unlikely to settle the issue.

I find myself on the fence. As Agent Mulder might say, "I want to believe", but I equally don't want to be financially taken for a fool. Therein lies the rub.
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slinger (Sat Apr 15, 2023 7:46 pm) • caterham (Sun Apr 16, 2023 12:20 am)
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Re: Power cables and fuses

Unread post by savvypaul »

About 10 years ago I bought a job lot of Russ Andrews power cables off eBay. They looked nice enough and they did no harm, but I couldn't tell any difference in the music. When my NVA amps arrived, I put the RA cables back on eBay (and they got bidded to around fifty percent more than I had originally paid for them).

What has made a difference is to always make sure that power cables do not run alongside signal cable (and don't run signal cables next to large transformers). Also, plug any SMPS powered equipment away from the rest of the system.

I once tried a Russ Andrews silver fuse. I couldn't tell any difference. Russ is looking cheap nowadays compared to some of the prices being asked. He must be gutted, lol. My personal view is that I don't need to try £150 fuses to prove that I am sane.
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TheRealAleman (Sun Apr 16, 2023 11:17 am)
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