Coronavirus restrictions: are they legal

[Lindsayt]

1936 Germany! I think you need to read some history.
Hilarious.

Please explain.

[ArloFlynn]

I eat tons of butter, full fat milk, cream in my coffee every day, cheeses, steak as often as affordable. Meats with plenty of fat. 2 eggs daily. Some fruits and vegs. 3000 iu of Vit D. I never wore a seat belt till I had a new car with a bleedin' Beeper! I wont wear a muzzle in a shop but if asked politely I oblige. I may catch Sars cov2 but I wont get Coronavirus and I wont give Coronavirus to you.

[CycleCoach]

I eat tons of butter, full fat milk, cream in my coffee every day, cheeses, steak as often as affordable. Meats with plenty of fat. 2 eggs daily. Some fruits and vegs. 3000 iu of Vit D. I never wore a seat belt till I had a new car with a bleedin' Beeper! I wont wear a muzzle in a shop but if asked politely I oblige. I may catch Sars cov2 but I wont get Coronavirus and I wont give Coronavirus to you.

The fact that you use the buzzword "muzzle" when describing a surgical mask tells me all I need to know about you. Wow.

[CycleCoach]

1936 Germany! I think you need to read some history.
Hilarious.

Please explain.

Maybe take the time to know the basic facts behind the ridiculous claims you're making.
Do you know any Jews? Ask them about their shared history of Nazi Germany and then ask them how insulting they feel your puerile comparison of their experiences with *being asked to stay at home and wear a mask* is.
Frankly you're making a fool of yourself.

[CycleCoach]

Hitler was democratically elected as part of a coalition government.

Yes, but he only seized overall (and ultimate) power through systematic intimidation, violence and murder of his opponents. It is, though, a useful reminder to be careful about who you vote for.

Even if we assume that you are correct, and the Covid Warden has been overzealous in issuing a fine without a warning, it doesn't come close to Nazi Germany. I understand that you are trying to demonstrate a principal, but I think it is a comparison that will seem absurd to the vast majority of people (and offensive to a fair percentage of that majority).

My attitude to individual liberty is relatively straightforward; my rights stop when your rights begin. In this case, my right to refuse to wear a mask in a shop stops when it threatens your right to life.

I'm sure there will be a few overzealous covid wardens, and police, and members of the public. The fact that such occurrences are worthy of being national news should be a good indicator that they are a relatively rare exception rather than the norm.

[CycleCoach]

And what is the actual legislation that says that anyone forgetting to wear their mask in a shop should be made to pay a fine?
I bet there's no such legislation.

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/202 ... tents/made

[CycleCoach]

I refer you back to my comment re seatbelts. They (our democratically elected government, (and, no, I didn't vote for them.)) made it a law: it doesn't matter if you agree with it or not, if you fail to comply you'll be fined: end of.
The reason it has to be compulsory is because some idiot will always think he's above the rules and thereby endanger others.
Like I also said, being asked to mask-up is to protect others. (This is a proven scientific fact not "rhetoric.") If you want to portray it as in some way suppressing your human rights then you're wrong (but hey: bring up the Bolsheviks and Nazis because that always wins the argument.)
There's only one set of "propaganda" on show here, and that's the refusenik bullshit that you're spouting.
In areas regarding public health I actually wish the authorities were even stricter because the libertarians amongst us would kill us all if thy had the chance.

The seat belt law is totalitarian.

Not wearing a seatbelt makes you no more of a danger to others than if you are wearing a seatbelt.
It only makes you more of a danger to yourself.

Does this mean that we should also ban people from eating butter?
Or more than 1 egg a day?
Or 2 cream cakes?

Or from crossing the road when the red man is lit?

Or from using a ladder?

Or going ski-ing?

Not wearing a seat belt makes it significantly more likely that you will suffer severe injury (or death) in the event of a crash. That impacts on emergency services. hospital staff, your family and friends and anyone who pays their taxes. No man is an island, I'm afraid.

[Lindsayt]

And what is the actual legislation that says that anyone forgetting to wear their mask in a shop should be made to pay a fine?
I bet there's no such legislation.

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/202 ... tents/made

Fail on 2 counts:

1 The title of the legislation says "Wearings of face coverings on public transport." The high street pharmacy where the incident occured was not public transport. It'd be a quite remarkable Tardis like contraption if it was.

2. In any event, the wording of the legislation includes the following:
"(2) Where a relevant person considers that a person is not wearing a face covering, in contravention of the requirement in regulation 3, the relevant person may—

(a)direct that person to wear such a covering;

(b)direct that person to disembark from the relevant vehicle.

(3) Where a person does not comply with a direction given to them by a constable under paragraph (2)(b), the constable may remove them from the relevant vehicle.

(4) A constable exercising the power in paragraph (3) may use reasonable force, if necessary, in the exercise of the power. "

The provisions of this law are to direct people to wear a covering or direct them to disembark from the vehicle. It's only when both of those are refused that the escalation towards a Fixed Penalty Notice should be taken.



And that's not even getting on to grounds for exemptions as described by this legislation, which may well apply to this delivery driver in this scenario.

So please, try again: "what is the actual legislation that says that anyone forgetting to wear their mask in a shop should be made to pay a fine?"

[Lindsayt]

Not wearing a seat belt makes it significantly more likely that you will suffer severe injury (or death) in the event of a crash. That impacts on emergency services. hospital staff, your family and friends and anyone who pays their taxes. No man is an island, I'm afraid.

Eating butter, eggs, etc make it significantly more likely that you will suffer severe internal injury or death from heart disease, cancer, stroke.

That impacts on emergency services, hospital staff, your family, friends and anyone that pays their taxes.

Using a ladder makes it significantly more likely that you will suffer sever injury or death. As does going ski-ing. etc etc etc.

[savvypaul]

And what is the actual legislation that says that anyone forgetting to wear their mask in a shop should be made to pay a fine?
I bet there's no such legislation.

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/202 ... tents/made

Fail on 2 counts:

1 The title of the legislation says "Wearings of face coverings on public transport." The high street pharmacy where the incident occured was not public transport. It'd be a quite remarkable Tardis like contraption if it was.

2. In any event, the wording of the legislation includes the following:
"(2) Where a relevant person considers that a person is not wearing a face covering, in contravention of the requirement in regulation 3, the relevant person may—

(a)direct that person to wear such a covering;

(b)direct that person to disembark from the relevant vehicle.

(3) Where a person does not comply with a direction given to them by a constable under paragraph (2)(b), the constable may remove them from the relevant vehicle.

(4) A constable exercising the power in paragraph (3) may use reasonable force, if necessary, in the exercise of the power. "

The provisions of this law are to direct people to wear a covering or direct them to disembark from the vehicle. It's only when both of those are refused that the escalation towards a Fixed Penalty Notice should be taken.



And that's not even getting on to grounds for exemptions as described by this legislation, which may well apply to this delivery driver in this scenario.

So please, try again: "what is the actual legislation that says that anyone forgetting to wear their mask in a shop should be made to pay a fine?"

Only a temporary fail. Posted wrong link.

Here's the correct one: https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/202 ... tents/made

I got that by googling 'face masks law shops'.